Sunday, February 26, 2006

The Arab Mindset

Pim’s Ghost explains how we fail to understand Arab/Islamic mindset and as a consequence our policies backfire. Our posture is self-defeating; our generosity only brings contempt; etc. Read it all!

26 Comments:

Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Another joker who just discovered Patai. Predictable.

He gets bent out of shape about The Three Little Pigs being removed. Wonder if Little Black Sambo is on the reading list.

Predictable tripe.

"That Bush desperately wanted the mission in Iraq to look like a mission of "friendliness" towards the Iraqi people instead of a no-holds-barred show of force.."

Damn, I blew coffee when I read that.

3/1/06, 1:25 PM  
Blogger Jason_Pappas said...

"Bunch of trouble"

I’m deleting your post because of the extreme hatred and viciousness.

Ducky may be a nasty Lefty and many use him as punching bag, but you’ve hit below the belt.

3/2/06, 8:40 AM  
Blogger Mark said...

Jason:

Darn good post! Patai's book is an excellent and very informative read. All Westerners need to read it.

I came to it after I had drawn my own conclusions about Arab culture and Islam when I returned to the UK after many years of working in the Gulf. It served well to reassure me that I had indeed drawn all the right conclusions about Islam and Muslims!

It's a truly wonderful book - so insightful, so accurate, so true! And a damn good, interesting read to boot! Un-put-downable!

3/2/06, 11:14 AM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Mark, Patai's book is considered a hack job based on sloppy methodology.

Would you please suggest a more balanced reading list. Taking a subject as broad and complex as "arabs" or "islam" and assuming a single text is authoritative is pretty foolish.

What else should "all weterners" read?

What conclusions have you drawn about "arabs" or "muslims"? Are they the same? My experience in Saudi taught me that they are lazy and that Egyptians are good dentists. What have you learned?

3/2/06, 1:42 PM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Three questions for Jason:

1. Why are the rest of Patai's books long out of print

2. If The Arab Mind is a serious work, why is it published by a no name company that sepcializes in bibles and muscle books?

3. Do you really believe a book on potty training is adequate to use as a foreign policy guide? (Careful with this one)

3/2/06, 1:53 PM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

I apologize, Jason. it seems that a number of his books are back in print. Don't seem to be selling very well but they are quite expensive.

3/2/06, 2:08 PM  
Blogger beakerkin said...

Ducky you might ask your pal Chomsky why his books are published in France by an outfit whose other major titles are Holocaust Denial.

3/2/06, 2:58 PM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

http://www.thenewpress.com/

Here you go, Beak. As you can see it is not a French publisher.

I do note that you can't go more than a couple minutes without mentioning the holocaust (when you aren't denying the Yezhovschina).

3/2/06, 3:23 PM  
Blogger Mark said...

Mr. Ducky:

Mark, Patai's book is considered a hack job based on sloppy methodology.

By whom? Please enlighten us.

Would you please suggest a more balanced reading list. Taking a subject as broad and complex as "arabs" or "islam" and assuming a single text is authoritative is pretty foolish.

If you hadn't noticed, that was no reading list; rather, it was one book in a long list!

What else should "all weterners" read?

Well, I would strongly recommend my own, naturally. After all, it was I who came out with the title, The Dawning of a New Dark Age back in 2003. Everybody's talking about a 'new dark age' these days. I must have been pretty far-seeing and perspicacious, huh?

What conclusions have you drawn about "arabs" or "muslims"? Are they the same? My experience in Saudi taught me that they are lazy and that Egyptians are good dentists. What have you learned?

I have drawn many conclusions about Arabs and Muslims from my experience of working with them and amongst them. But what I found so exciting about Patai's book is that I drew my own conclusions first, BEFORE reading The Arab Mind. It was pretty exciting to find that I had drawn all the right conclusions! My findings tallied with Patai's findings!

If all you learnt in Saudi was that Arabs are lazy and that Egyptians make good dentists, then you didn't find out very much about the Arab mind, did you? Perhaps you had better go back and find out some more. Or, easier still, read Patai's The Arab Mind. That would be fraught with far less risk for you.

If The Arab Mind is a serious work, why is it published by a no name company that sepcializes in bibles and muscle books?

Serious works often are published by lesser-known publishing houses. Big publishing houses often prefer 'bodice rippers', for they sell far more. Serious academic works often sell far less well, because the mass market is tailored to less acadameic stuff. Compare the sales of wonderful classical music with the sales of popular music. In terms of musical standard, there is no comparison; yet the sales of the rubbishy stuff far outweighs the sales of the good stuff.

Porsche Boxsters are wonderful cars, as are Mercedes Sports, but the sales of these cars are far outstripped by the cheaper, lower-quality models. Fine taste in cars, music, and books, is not to be found so easily.

Do you really believe a book on potty training is adequate to use as a foreign policy guide? (Careful with this one)

If you believe that Patai's book is all about potty-training, then you either haven't read it, or else if you have, you haven't understood it!

Before signing off, may I ask you a question, Mr. Ducky? I have noticed that whenever, and wherever I find your comments, I always sense and air of cynicism in them, and I find them NEGATIVE - ALWAYS! Don't you ever have anything POSITIVE to say about ANYBODY at ANYTIME?

You need to try it sometime. It is so satisfying!

3/2/06, 4:42 PM  
Blogger John Sobieski said...

Andre Servier's book Islam and the Psychology of the Musulman is a better book. It's free. I put it online here. It's no longer copyright, 1913. The observations he made are the same today.

Musulmanbook

3/2/06, 5:15 PM  
Blogger beakerkin said...

Ducky

You can't go more then a single post without mentioning Jews or mitigating the historic crimes of Islam.

It took you two days to admit what the rest of the world knew on Front Page Forum. I asked you for two days WHO BLEW UP THE WTC. You are quite verbose but it took you two days.

Chomsky ( A Commie and Commies are not Joooos or American as they are traitors) has his French books published by an outfit who publishes Holocaust denial books.
Why do Commies like Chomsky and Finky bleat about Facism and Nazism but readily associate with
real Nazis.

Jeapordy Music

Hmmm Commies have a history of working with Nazis but all of us knew that even the Duck.

3/2/06, 8:47 PM  
Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

"The Muslims in Persia are wicked and treacherous. The law which their prophet Mohamet[Muhammad] has given them lays down that any harm they may do to one who does not accept their law, and any appropriation of his goods, is no sin at all.. And if they suffer death at the hands of Christians, they are accounted martyrs. For this reason they would be great wrongdoers, if it were not for the government. And all the other Muslims in the world act on the same principle. When they are on the point of death up comes their priest[Mullah] and asks whether they believe that Mahomet was the true messenger of God; if they answer "Yes" then he tells them that they are saved." - From Marco Polo's Diary (The Travels of Marco Polo, pp57-58 Penguin Books 1958)

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"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilisation of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilisation of ancient Rome.” —Sir Winston Churchill, from The River War, first edition, Vol. II, pages 248-50 (London: Longmans, Green & Co., 1899).

-----

"Field reports to the U.S. Government, countless eye-witness journalistic accounts, reports of International agencies such as World Bank and additional information available to the subcommittee document the reign of terror which grips East Bengal (East Pakistan). Hardest hit have been members of the Hindu community who have been robbed of their lands and shops, systematically slaughtered, and in some places, painted with yellow patches marked "H". All of this has been officially sanctioned, ordered and implemented under martial law from Islamabad." - Crisis in South Asia - A report by Senator Edward Kennedy to the Subcommittee investigating the Problem of Refugees and Their Settlement, Submitted to U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee, November 1, 1971, U.S. Govt. Press, pp.6-7.

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"I covered the war and witnessed first the population's joyous welcome of the Indian soldiers as liberators .. Later I toured the country by road to see the Pakistani legacy firsthand. In town after town there was an execution area where people had been killed by bayonet, bullet and bludgeon. In some towns, executions were held on a daily basis .. This was a month after the war's end (i.e. January 1972), ... human bones were still scattered along many roadsides. Blood stained clothing and tufts of human hair clung to the brush at these killing grounds. Children too young to understand were playing grotesque games with skulls. Other reminders were the yellow "H"s the Pakistanis had painted on the homes of the Hindus, particular targets of the Muslim army." - The Pakistani Slaughter That Nixon Ignored , Syndicated Column by Sydney Schanberg, New York Times, May 3, 1994.

3/2/06, 10:52 PM  
Blogger Pim's Ghost said...

Aha! It seems that mr. ducky and I have now become aware of each other. Ducky, I am quite a joker, but hardly on this subject (unless you count my efforts in Photoshop). However, I have hardly JUST discovered Patai, I merely decided to cite his work in this particular article.

If you really want to see "a hack job based on sloppy methodology", the current issue of Practicing Anthropology should serve your needs quite well (for table of contents see www.sfaa.net). Attitudes like yours in academia, by the way, are exactly why so many Anthropologists are leaving academia for Ethnography and other fields of work.

As for predictable tripe, I'll keep reading your responses.

3/3/06, 8:28 AM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

Nice selective readinds Beamish. Of course the Marco Polo section could apply to Europe in the Dark Ages just as easily.

3/3/06, 9:56 AM  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

Several famous historical figures have spoken condemnatory words about Islam--before the rise of "Islamism." Today it's not pc to talk about some of those quotations, but it's high time we did.

In reality, Patai's book is not anti-Arab or even anti-Islam. I recall something like this in the book: "fascinated by all things Araby." Rather, Patai examines history, culture, and linguistics (That last particularly appeals to me).

I wonder if the book is still used. It used to be required reading for those entering foreign service in the Middle East.

3/3/06, 10:25 AM  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

Ducky enjoys dishing out negative comments. I'll forego the psycholanalysis on that.

3/3/06, 10:26 AM  
Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

Damn, Ducky. Putting Marco Polo in the "Dark Ages" that ended nearly 300 years before his birth was gratuitous. All you had to say is "I am a leftist," and the example of your ignorance of history and any other subject matter could have been taken for granted.

3/3/06, 12:26 PM  
Blogger American Crusader said...

You're absolutely correct. Our generosity and willingness to amend our ways for their benefit is seen as weakness and is exploited for just that reason. The only solution is a firm stand with no compromise. If the left wants to bend over, fine..as long as I don't get reamed in the process.

3/3/06, 2:07 PM  
Blogger kevin said...

Ducky,
Now all you need to do is discredit the Koran, it seems to make Islam look pretty bad as well.

3/4/06, 1:46 PM  
Blogger Ouzian said...

its difficult to understand the arab mentality becoz you have to venture into the fields of hard core selfishness and lose your senses.

3/8/06, 3:06 AM  
Blogger Pim's Ghost said...

kevin--nice one!

3/8/06, 12:06 PM  
Blogger Mr. Ducky said...

No pim, kevin the silly could just as easily have said that Leviticus makes jews appear to be scum.

He's just another instant islamic scholar. We seem to be turning them out at assembly line speed and none of them can find a clue with a flashlight.

Primitive little haters who are accomplishing nothing.

3/8/06, 2:09 PM  
Blogger Jason_Pappas said...

Actually, the hate is in the Islamic community powered by Islamic supremacism. You can read about it daily.

Ducky is using an old Nazi trick, used to paint the critics of Nazism anti-German bigots to deflect attention from the real hate. Next we’ll hear about how we can’t judge Nazism unless we’ve read Mein Kampf or judge communism until we’ve become scholars of Das Kapital.

The Big Lie doesn’t work here. Try pedaling it elsewhere.

3/8/06, 2:28 PM  
Blogger Mr. Beamish the Instablepundit said...

Mr. Ducky, eternally prepared to demonstrate that leftists are incapable of rational thought, bleats that people critical of Islam know nothing of Islam.

So, Ducky, when did you convert to Islam?

3/8/06, 4:59 PM  
Blogger American Crusader said...

"So, Ducky, when did you convert to Islam?"

My guess is after 911.

3/8/06, 5:52 PM  
Blogger Pim's Ghost said...

Ducky--do you even have a site, or do you simply bug people about what they write on their sites? As for your theory of the "instant Islamic scholars", some of us out here have advanced degrees and are not new to this field of study nor did we discover Islam only after 9/11.

As for what is being turned out at an alarming rate in the US, I would contend that it is a generation of spoiled brats who refuse to grow up and continue trying to bite the hands that feed them. Hating Western Civilization will get one nowhere, and is as outdated as your hero's picture and ideals.

Ducky, did your family barely escape genocide at the hands of Muslims for being non-Muslims? Mine did. But go ahead, keep couching your arguments in this Western-centric manner and continue to believe that you are the one who is not bigoted. I will continue to disagree with this line of thinking, as I consider it bigoted and immature.

Please visit my site for debate, however, I would love to continue the conversation. You have even inspired a new article I believe, so I thank you. Happy Birthday to me.

3/11/06, 2:15 PM  

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